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Explorer ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Chang, you have great comments. Somebody who has more money than me should take out full page ads in the Wall Street Journal and NY Times that that reprint your comment. 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@GLI2019 wrote:

"I'm in Denmark and see no one wearing masks. Why no uptick in cases? That's the kind of question I was addressing."

Well, re Denmark, here's a link to a highly instructive piece, published in a respected source,  written by two well-informed professionals:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1359610120300952

Bob

 


Hi Bob,

Good piece, thanks. I concur about the Danish respect for government and for rules, quite the opposite of the French attitude. About touching, well our neighbors just dropped by to welcome us with handshakes. But, yes, Danes are more like Germans than like French.

The other thing is that Denmark closed its borders very early. France did not, and the virus carried in by visitors from Italy and China. Closing borders seems to have been the most effective strategy. On the other hand, absolutely no immunity has been developed.

Denmark just reopened to some EU countries a few days ago.  We'll have to see how things go. We were interviewed upon arrival and had show proof of booking for a six-day stay. No quarantine though.

Sadly, I'm reading that Greece is already seeing a pop in new cases since reopening, and may close the borders again.

N.

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Explorer ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Chang, Would you mind if people on this board took a screenshot of your great comment and emailed it to 60 Minutes, their Senator and the White House? Your point needs much more media coverage. Maybe...maybe the people posting comments could help change things for the better. 

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Contributor ○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Norbie, I am glad to see you finally admit that your unbridled faith in POTUS was misplaced. We can't fix a problem until it is acknowledged. You are right about masks. Masking is a daily thang in Japan and we are better for it.

Mustang, I know that you don't necessarily ascribe to the explanation but really, the huge spike (15,000+ today in Florida!) is because of the riots (?) and Mexico? Bad black, young and Hispanic people? Not the irresponsible and hasty reopening of the states by their politically pressured governors? And the anti-science bizarro refusal to wear masks?

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Participant ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

There might be other reasons also.  First, a healthier population which enjoys national health care.  Secondly, the government refunds the private sector for sick leave used due to Covid-19.  Thirdly a uniform response. The hospitals in Denmark are owned by the regional governments. At the outbreak, resources were reallocated.  In addition, tracing was instituted to monitor the virus.  

Here there is no universal sick leave, many don't have it.  Many don't have health insurance (the highest is TX  adults, with 20% uninsured).  If you don't have health insurance, most won't get tested, the test is expensive - $352 at Urgent Care).  And let's not even go into the current state of the health of the American people.  Denmark's socialist model seems to work there; it might work here if adopted.   

Here we can't even get a straight answer from the federal government on reopening schools.  The CDC has guidelines, the Sec. of Education won't even support those modest measures. 

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Contributor ○

Re: Coronavirus success story

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@norbertc wrote:

@GLI2019 wrote:

"I'm in Denmark and see no one wearing masks. Why no uptick in cases? That's the kind of question I was addressing."

Well, re Denmark, here's a link to a highly instructive piece, published in a respected source,  written by two well-informed professionals:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1359610120300952

Bob

 


Hi Bob,

Good piece, thanks. I concur about the Danish respect for government and for rules, quite the opposite of the French attitude. About touching, well our neighbors just dropped by to welcome us with handshakes. But, yes, Danes are more like Germans than like French.

The other thing is that Denmark closed its borders very early. France did not, and the virus carried in by visitors from Italy and China. Closing borders seems to have been the most effective strategy. On the other hand, absolutely no immunity has been developed.

Denmark just reopened to some EU countries a few days ago.  We'll have to see how things go. We were interviewed upon arrival and had show proof of booking for a six-day stay. No quarantine though.

Sadly, I'm reading that Greece is already seeing a pop in new cases since reopening, and may close the borders again.

N.


I dunno man, Mustang's link below from Fox News has a doctor stating that our surge in new cases is not due to re-opening economies and all that entails, but rather Mexicans and BLM protesters. They got a lot of that in Greece and Denmark? If not, you'll be fine. 

Good news is that the same doctor says that children are not at risk and hardly even spread this disease. He sounds credible. And he said nothing about churches, bars or strip clubs. So my Friday, Saturday and Sunday plans are all still intact.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

@rumples 

It should be noted that France also has national health care and implemented comparable measures to Denmark in response to Covid-19. I think Denmark's recent success comes down to two things:

1) Early closure of borders

2) Danish character: trust in government and willingness to follow rules.

France does not possess these qualities, although its wines are undeniably superior.

I'll add that Denmark is hardly "socialist". Unlike France, there's little or no centralized control; business is free to act. However, Denmark does offer attractive welfare benefits, which come at the price of very high taxes. It's a small, homogenous country.

N.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@pudman wrote:

Norbie, I am glad to see you finally admit that your unbridled faith in POTUS was misplaced. We can't fix a problem until it is acknowledged. You are right about masks. Masking is a daily thang in Japan and we are better for it.

Mustang, I know that you don't necessarily ascribe to the explanation but really, the huge spike (15,000+ today in Florida!) is because of the riots (?) and Mexico? Bad black, young and Hispanic people? Not the irresponsible and hasty reopening of the states by their politically pressured governors? And the anti-science bizarro refusal to wear masks?


You are incorrect, Sir! Many of them Governors were happy to oblige. They seem like willing surrogates. 

With plenty of protests in Northern states they are not seeing a similar surge. Obviously, large gatherings are not good with no distancing or masks, but clearly more going on than that. It is the exclusion of those other factors that makes "Dr Atlas" appear propaganda driven. 

I'm led to wonder how much economic damage might be done by promoting such narratives to folks that are using then as a rationale to flout medical advise and spread the virus further? Ironically, as Fox points the finger elsewhere, they might be making this whole matter much worse by not presenting all the facts. 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

@DrVenture 

My girlfriend is Mexican and I'm fine. OK, it's just a sample of one, but I think this proves that Mexicans have nothing to do with the surge of cases along the border.

As for the Buy Low Methodology (BLM), I'm not sure. Denmark is very pricey. No bargains here unless you go for Herring in a big way.

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Contributor ○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

I stand (6 feet away) corrected. A few weeks ago I walked down through CHAZ/CHOP as it is in the neighbourhood I grew up in and noticed that, even though predominantly young, most seemed to be masked up. 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@norbertc wrote:

@DrVenture 

My girlfriend is Mexican and I'm fine. OK, it's just a sample of one, but I think this proves that Mexicans have nothing to do with the surge of cases along the border.

As for the Buy Low Methodology (BLM), I'm not sure. Denmark is very pricey. No bargains here unless you go for Herring in a big way.


LOL - I'll accept that sample of one! Works for me. Enjoy your trip. Be safe.

P.S. I ate a lot of pickled herring as a child. It was always in the house. Haven't had it in years. Dad loved it.

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

@pudmanOur governor is tracking the data daily.  We are open and not experiencing a surge.  There are new cases and new deaths but there isn't a resurgence. Here are a couple of charts that are published:

https://twitter.com/Rinteln/status/1282351775551455232/photo/3

Someone posted a chart just 4-5 pages ago that showed the spike in cases in Chili, Brazil and Mexico.  Since several sources are showing or talking about it I tend to think its real.

And I forget who the jerk was who tried to make it sound like they were anything but another victim of the disease. Shame on you.

Someone posted a picture of a group of Asians wearing masks.  I tried to go back and find it.  If I remember correctly they were not wearing N95 masks.  But I could be wrong.

Someone said that the number of cases increasing shows the number of deaths increasing.  That isn't true at all. Before the only cases that were reported were those that ended up in the emergency room.  Wide spread testing has only recently become available.  My state has started an aggressive program to randomly test people to try to discover how many cases were under reported.  I have read that somewhere around 40% of those testing positive for the antibodies (meaning they had the disease) didn't show any symptoms.  Another state tested a nursing home and found 40% of the residents who tested positive for the antibodies never had symptoms.  We are capturing those individuals now.  In fact, we have enough testing material now that anyone can go in and get tested. Many are.

And that doesn't count in the far better treatments that we have now.  New ones are being developed all the time.

Since we're talking nonsense, here is something important for us O blood types.  It appears that we have some built in immunity.  Sorry A types.  I really don't think you can change your blood type. If you get sick maybe you can get a transfusion.  O negative is the universal donor.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/if-you-have-this-blood-type-studies-show-you-e2-80-99re-at-...

 

 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

@Mustang 

If it's true that testing is bring ramped up and is identifying a lot of people with the virus, but without symptoms, that's great news.  If true, the death rate is lower than assumed, as previously only people with symptoms were counted ... essentially just people who walked into a clinic.

I'll be watching the death rate and hospitalization statistics with interest over the coming days and weeks. Let's hope for the best.

Yes, treatment know-how is improving.

Sadly, we have a small group actually cheering the soaring case count for political reasons. How pathetic is that?

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

@norbertcI edited my post to include some additional information.  I may have done that after you read it.  Sorry.  And yes I am aware there is a lot of politics involved.  But I don't want to play that game.

The charts in the link show several factors such as testing, new cases, deaths (which are way down), etc.  If you missed them you might want to go back and look.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

What Norbert wrote:

"Sadly, we have a small group actually cheering the soaring case count for political reasons. How pathetic is that?"

That's over the top to say some are cheering on a higher death rate.

It's a disgusting shameful comment and says more about you than anyone else. Pathetic.👎

Bob

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Participant ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

I don't see anyone celebrating the number of cases and the number of deaths, not even those touting "herd immunity" as if letting the most vulnerable die is somehow moral.  What I do see is a callus disregard for the suffering on the part of many in the US who fail to take the most basic measures.  It is remarkable that someone says wear a 50 cent face mask is an infringement on their liberty.  Thank goodness I don't live in FL where the governor doesn't care how many are getting ill, how full the hospitals are, come rain or shine or the number of dead, he wants those schools open.  They need to be open, but while students can be even taught in shifts, though he doesn't support that, there are only a limited number of teachers. 

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Re: Coronavirus success story


@rumples wrote:

I don't see anyone celebrating the number of cases and the number of deaths, not even those touting "herd immunity" as if letting the most vulnerable die is somehow moral.  What I do see is a callus disregard for the suffering on the part of many in the US who fail to take the most basic measures.  It is remarkable that someone says wear a 50 cent face mask is an infringement on their liberty.  Thank goodness I don't live in FL where the governor doesn't care how many are getting ill, how full the hospitals are, come rain or shine or the number of dead, he wants those schools open.  They need to be open, but while students can be even taught in shifts, though he doesn't support that, there are only a limited number of teachers. 


Exactly, +1. It sad to see some shameful posts on death counts. Nobody would cheer on that. People who even think like that should get a life.

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

What in the world are you talking about?  No one other than me said anything about death counts.  I said they were unrelated to case counts and posted charts showing how far down they have dropped in my state even though we now have an open economy.  I think that is something to cheer about.

P.S. Norbert didn't say anything about death counts.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

Some good news. New York City reports zero COVID-19 deaths for first time since pandemic hit.

 

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