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Contributor ○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Would you get on a plane knowing that the person next to you may refuse mid air to wear a mask.  This is the type of problem why US businesses are not able to reopen or stay reopened.   The economy will continue to suffer as long as businesses can not stay reopened.  Businesses are closing voluntarily (fear of getting sued) not because Govt is asking them to.  All the Vegas Casinos have said they will fire employees and kick out customers not wearing masks.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

White House rejects national strategy on masks

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

This is the real coronavirus success story: over 3 million cases with more than 132,000 deaths. LINK

Are we number one or what?

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@CarlosDS wrote:

This is the real coronavirus success story: over 3 million cases with more than 132,000 deaths.


Everett’s Law of Statistics: “Anyone who cites numerators without denominators is trying to mislead you.”

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Participant ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

We have been told its a hoax, that it will go away in the summer, that its no worse than the flu...on the other hand at the request of FEMA, the US military, the 627th Hospital Center at Ft. Carson, announced 50 medical personnel are being dispatched to San Antonio to be embedded with local medical personnel that are at the breaking point.  This is less than the number sent to NY, but significant in that it shows this is not under control despite wishful thinking. There is no national strategy. 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

Chang raised a good point. Here is the list with denominator that Chang wanted. The list is sorted with decreasing number of deaths/per 100 k people. I extracted the data from CNN and sorted the data.I was also interested in this list. Tennessee is not bad at 40 but within Tennessee, my county is comparable to even Nashville.

Reported cases and deaths    
LocationCases 3...per 100K peopleDeaths...per 100K people
New Jersey173611195515229171
New York397649204432219166
Connecticut4697613184338122
Massachusetts11013715988198119
Rhode Island16991160496091
District of Columbia10515149056179
Louisiana663271427329671
Michigan73267734622162
Illinois1478651167702655
Maryland699041156324654
Pennsylvania95100743675453
Delaware12293126251253
Indiana48524721269840
Mississippi312571050111437
Colorado34240595169129
New Hampshire591443538228
Georgia97065914287627
Minnesota38569684151127
Arizona1014411394182625
Ohio57956496292725
New Mexico1350764451525
Iowa31705100572323
Virginia66102774185322
Alabama44878915100721
Florida206447961377818
Washington35898471135918
Nevada2290974453717
California271013686644016
South Carolina4638090182716
Nebraska20046103628315
North Carolina74775713143214
Wisconsin3206155179614
Kentucky1714638459213
South Dakota71058039711
Tennessee5203576264910
Arkansas2381478928710
Kansas1660257028510
Oklahoma1636241339910
North Dakota38495058010
Texas20338970126659
Vermont1251200569
Maine34232551098
Oregon103952462155
Puerto Rico79162481555
Idaho7733433935
West Virginia3442192955
Wyoming1675289203
Montana1249117232
Alaska1162159162
Hawaii103073191
Guam301 5 
Other‘152 3 
US Virgin Islands112 6 
Northern Mariana Islands31 2 
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Explorer ○

Re: Coronavirus success story

The American bickering over masks astonishes me. Medical masks have been in use for over a century. They’ve been thoroughly researched and proven. They’re standard issue in hospitals around the world. Now, in the depths of a global pandemic, do we really need to relitigate them?

Why do Americans lose their minds over something most of the world takes in stride? Wearing a mask is easy and inexpensive. Are we so childish that we can’t do such a basic thing to control a deadly virus?

If today’s America was transported back to 1941, WWII might have had a far different outcome. The Axis powers would have rolled over the planet while we fought amongst ourselves over gas rationing.

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Contributor ○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Presumably the no-mask-is-LIBERTY! people also play football and ride motorcycles without a helmet, never use condoms, seatbelts or umbrellas, and dominate the annual Darwin Awards. There is no real controversy or people fighting over masks. It is just that some folks are just ignorant, selfish or enjoy the attention seeking drama of being contrary. It is really that simple. All the rest is just blahblahblah.

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Participant ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Early in the pandemic, the governor saying there was no direction from Washington, declared a state of emergency, we just entered phase three reopening.  The past 24 hours have seen no reported Covid-19 deaths.  That might change of course, but when asked what is his primary factor in making the reopening decision he said it was the death rate.  Following the data and not wishful thinking has let VA so far do fairly well despite in the early stages our being hit hard. Masks are still required, the Commonwealth has a hotline for the public to call to report violations.  The emergency employer rules are still expected to take effect on July 15:

https://www.doli.virginia.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/COVID-19-ETS-Emg-Reg-Infectious-Disease-Pre...

As these rules highlight, there is more to this than just wearing masks, it requires more in the way of cleanliness (seems some employers have to be told to have soap and water in the rest rooms), letting employees know of cases, distancing, reporting, separation of positive and negative patients and so forth.  

There are other things which have been done by the Commonwealth to limit exposure.  For example, VA has a yearly vehicle inspection requirement.  New inspection rules are in place so the inspector doesn't have to enter the vehicle.  DMV has started to take appointments; I went with a friend while she got her new driver's license.  In and out in less than 10 minutes (they mail it to you here).  Only the person getting the license is allowed in - I had to wait in the car. 

(VA is the only state with a physician serving as Governor; he was practicing up until he was elected.  VA Governors can only serve one term so they don't have to worry about reelection.)

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@pudman wrote:

Presumably the no-mask-is-LIBERTY! people also play football and ride motorcycles without a helmet, never use condoms, seatbelts or umbrellas, and dominate the annual Darwin Awards. There is no real controversy or people fighting over masks. It is just that some folks are just ignorant, selfish or enjoy the attention seeking drama of being contrary. It is really that simple. All the rest is just blahblahblah.


Using bold face type is definitely a nice touch.  Have you considered using color to further embellish your missives? 

Are you still doing stand-up comedy?  It must be challenging while wearing a mask.  A good time to get your first book published? 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

The USA ranks fairly high among nations looking at per capita Covid-19 cases, but less high looking at per-capita deaths.

Does anyone have a theory to explain why the US death rate is as low as it is?  Better resistance in Summer?   Or, could it be that testing is more widespread now, and that other countries have / had equally high per capita cases?

One argument against masks is that they inhibit the spreading of the virus at a time when it appears less harmless; that would theoretically be helpful to achieve herd immunity.

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story


@norbertc wrote:

The USA ranks fairly high among nations looking at per capita Covid-19 cases, but less high looking at per-capita deaths.

Does anyone have a theory to explain why the US death rate is as low as it is?  Better resistance in Summer?   Or, could it be that testing is more widespread now, and that other countries have / had equally high per capita cases?

<snip>


"In general, experts see three broad reasons for the downward trend in the rate of coronavirus deaths: testing, treatment and a shift in whom the virus is infecting. The relative contribution of these factors is not yet clear. And because death reports can lag diagnoses by weeks, the current rise in coronavirus cases could still portend increases in mortality in the days to come."

Link

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story


@Regal1956 wrote:

The American bickering over masks astonishes me. Medical masks have been in use for over a century. They’ve been thoroughly researched and proven. They’re standard issue in hospitals around the world. Now, in the depths of a global pandemic, do we really need to relitigate them?

Why do Americans lose their minds over something most of the world takes in stride? Wearing a mask is easy and inexpensive. Are we so childish that we can’t do such a basic thing to control a deadly virus?

<snip>


The Texas governor ordered residents in most counties to wear masks in public.
Some Houston rodeo spectators did not comply with the governor's order.
One man stated: "I'm an American and I feel that I should be able to do what I want to. I pay my taxes, I live free, I want to be free."

Sadly, this seems to be the attitude shared by many who choose not to wear masks. These people somehow feel that their freedom is under assault. They neglect to consider their communal responsiblity to fight this global pandemic.

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Contributor ○

Re: Coronavirus success story

US came to the Covid drama much later than many other countries.  This could be because we use much less public transport and because of other non-communal way of our life.  The current lower death rate is because we are benefiting from our and other countries’ experience in treating acute cases.  The medical literature now has the full gamut of potential symptoms and how to handle them. Not all symptoms show up in everybody.  This is the most efficient virus man has encountered.  We now also have two known therapies that were not known before.

What we need now is some humility and not a constant usurpation of all chance good fortune as our personal ingenuity and treating all chance misfortune as somebody else’s fault.  We in our psyche have to start reversing the habit of constant bifurcation of burdens from benefits.  

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Participant ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story

Going by death rates is misleading.  The cost to individuals and their families of medical care, missing work has yet to be measured.  In VA, both death rates and hospitalizations are down.  Will there be a wave of personal bankruptcies coming?  

https://www.americanbanker.com/opinion/the-calm-before-the-storm-of-bankruptcies

And then there is the end of rent payment abeyance.  Will there be increased homelessness?  There are still many unknowns.  

There are versions of an old joke from the Soviet era during Brezhnev which goes something along these lines (I'm recapping), close the curtains to the train's windows and pretend we are still moving.  That seems to be the attitude of many, pretend its business as usual. 

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Explorer ○

Re: Coronavirus success story


@norbertc wrote:

The USA ranks fairly high among nations looking at per capita Covid-19 cases, but less high looking at per-capita deaths.


The United States death rate isn’t low by any measure. Among the 20 most populous countries, the USA has the highest per capita death rate. Out of 213 countries, we’re in 9th place. None of this strikes me as anything to be proud of.

For those who argue that some countries are reporting artificially low rates, bear in mind that other countries—Belgium, for example—are reporting artificially high numbers. So arguing that the numbers are wrong cuts both ways. It’s probably a wash.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story

@chang 

We went over different denominators the other day and there was no doubt we still are the number one. As an updated example, we are #13 in cases/million people. From Europe, only Vatican City and San Marino are worse than us. The other ten countries are undeveloped ones. 

Increased collective knowledge on how to treat COVID cases (low dose corticosteroids, low molecular weight heparin, remdesivir) are some factors that explain the lower mortality rate in the US. IMO, we lost the war against the virus due to ...

(I'll leave it like that, otherwise, the 1st amendment haters will call Ryan complaining that someone is bothering their bubble).   

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Coronavirus success story


@CarlosDS wrote:............  Unfortunately, we have many ignorant, reckless, and selfish dudes in our Country.


For one that belongs to the party of tolerance I would think you could understand another point of view. Too bad you are so intolerant.

Generally it is better to worry and protects one's self as opposed to demand others protect you.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@ECEPROF wrote:
White House rejects national strategy on masks


The lack of a unified response is the primary problem. It almost seems like the policy intent is to make the pandemic worse in America.

 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Coronavirus success story


@Regal1956 wrote:

@norbertc wrote:

The USA ranks fairly high among nations looking at per capita Covid-19 cases, but less high looking at per-capita deaths.


The United States death rate isn’t low by any measure. Among the 20 most populous countries, the USA has the highest per capita death rate. Out of 213 countries, we’re in 9th place. None of this strikes me as anything to be proud of.

For those who argue that some countries are reporting artificially low rates, bear in mind that other countries—Belgium, for example—are reporting artificially high numbers. So arguing that the numbers are wrong cuts both ways. It’s probably a wash.


The US death rate is significantly lower than that of the UK, France, Spain, Italy, Sweden, and other countries:

ScreenHunter 772.png

The most successful countries (e.g., Greece, Thailand, and Australia) decided to close their borders early on.  It's notable that Germany has done quite well too, perhaps thanks to a disciplined population with a population less inclined to touching others.

The US has a high per capita infection rate, but a relatively low death rate.

N.

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