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Participant ○

Catholic Church and PPP Loans

Did you see the article in the AP that the RC church lobbied to be allowed to collect PPP loans which we all know will become grants?  And we are talking about 1.4 to 3.5 billion dollars.  How in the world is an organization that is tax exempt get away with this?  And they can claim their teachers are “ministers” and fire them without being subject to usual government regulations.  

Ryan, I don’t mean this to be anyway political.  And I might add I received 16 years of RC education.  It just seems as totally unfair to me.

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Follower ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

I agree gilvkona.  Couldn't they just have sold one of those priceless works of art for a few billion?  And, yes, the nuns, and priests all gave me an excellent education as well for which I am extremely grateful.

Another recipient that really irks me is the PPP loan that went to the Ayn Rand organization.  Loved this letter to the LA Times today that asked:   "Which part of championing unbridled private sector capitalism, disdain for the public sector, and the supremacy of self-reliance do you think the Ayn Rand Institute found most convenient when applying for a PPP loan?"

Stay safe (wear that mask) and be well!

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

        They vote Republican, part of the base. 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

I agree with you. It is not just catholics alone. Besides, did you know that many mega churches also received such aids? What happened to the principle of separation state and church. It appears that it does not matter when it comes to money.


@gilvkona wrote:

Did you see the article in the AP that the RC church lobbied to be allowed to collect PPP loans which we all know will become grants?  And we are talking about 1.4 to 3.5 billion dollars.  How in the world is an organization that is tax exempt get away with this?  And they can claim their teachers are “ministers” and fire them without being subject to usual government regulations.  

Ryan, I don’t mean this to be anyway political.  And I might add I received 16 years of RC education.  It just seems as totally unfair to me.


 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans


@ECEPROF wrote:

I agree with you. It is not just catholics alone. Besides, did you know that many mega churches also received such aids? What happened to the principle of separation state and church. It appears that it does not matter when it comes to money.


@gilvkona wrote:

Did you see the article in the AP that the RC church lobbied to be allowed to collect PPP loans which we all know will become grants?  And we are talking about 1.4 to 3.5 billion dollars.  How in the world is an organization that is tax exempt get away with this?  And they can claim their teachers are “ministers” and fire them without being subject to usual government regulations.  

Ryan, I don’t mean this to be anyway political.  And I might add I received 16 years of RC education.  It just seems as totally unfair to me.


Ha. Ha. That all went out with “providing national defense and regulating interstate commerce”.  That whole constitutional document is long gone. 


 

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Explorer ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

Religious organizations have employees too. First amendment does not exclude them from these loans.

Contributor ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

I guarantee you that is not the case. Generalizations are usually wrong. I can't believe you said that. With a little digging I am sure at least 1 atheist organization got PPP money.

Well at least they may use the money to stop abortions. Wouldn't that get some people angry?


@steelpony10 wrote:

        They vote Republican, part of the base. 


 

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Participant ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

The Roman Catholic Church is not alone.  (Note that I said Roman, since the Greek Orthodox and Episcopal Church are also Catholic - apostolic succession; pedantic I know, but they are sensitive about it.)  Diocese finances are separate from the wealth of Rome; many are bankrupt.  

The legislation was drafted in haste, it may have been necessary, but without hearings open to the public this type of thing was bound to happen.  It probably would have happened anyway, but in the light of day and maybe would not have seen nefarious. 

In the end, many corporations got money they may not have needed while others waited.

The suffering of small business is yet to be determined.  For decades when I would go to Richmond, I would stop at Jean Jacques Bakery.  A European/French bakery since 1983.  The owners killed themselves three weeks ago during the shutdown . We may never know if they got their relief money.  

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans


@gilvkona wrote:

Did you see the article in the AP that the RC church lobbied to be allowed to collect PPP loans which we all know will become grants?  And we are talking about 1.4 to 3.5 billion dollars.  How in the world is an organization that is tax exempt get away with this?  And they can claim their teachers are “ministers” and fire them without being subject to usual government regulations.  

Ryan, I don’t mean this to be anyway political.  And I might add I received 16 years of RC education.  It just seems as totally unfair to me.


Religious organizations have also experienced a decline in revenue. $3B is 0.1% of the money allocated to the recovery program.

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans


@Gary1952 wrote:

I guarantee you that is not the case. Generalizations are usually wrong. I can't believe you said that. With a little digging I am sure at least 1 atheist organization got PPP money.

Well at least they may use the money to stop abortions. Wouldn't that get some people angry?


@steelpony10 wrote:

        They vote Republican, part of the base. 


 


Where there is a heartbeat there is life. They get my vote.

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Explorer ○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

outandabout,

Are you a vegetarian?

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

gilvkona, if you're going to name one why not name them all?

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Participant ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

If any church receives federal money they should give up their tax-exempt status.

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Participant ○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

@rumplesYes, I understand that dioceses are separate from Rome and a work of art can’t be sold.  I figured that out as a grammar school kid or rather I was told those were the rules.  We built a brand new church when I was a kid.  Every Sunday we heard sermons about how our church borrowed the funds from the diocese and we had to pay it back.  Even as a pre-teen that struck me as totally arbitrary.  They were rules made up by the entity.  It could have been made up a different way.  I think, even at that early age, I began my doubts of “corporate” religion. 

@Intruder Yes, it is a trivial amount.  But it just seems wrong, separation of church and state.

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Participant ○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

@outandabout You are right!  I read the article.  Luckily all of you have shown me that the program had more flaws.  

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans


@Gary1952 wrote:

I guarantee you that is not the case. Generalizations are usually wrong. I can't believe you said that. With a little digging I am sure at least 1 atheist organization got PPP money.

Well at least they may use the money to stop abortions. Wouldn't that get some people angry?


@steelpony10 wrote:

        They vote Republican, part of the base. 


        Ha. Ha. Gary1952 - you started this brouhaha. Referring to the OP only my opinion then is “most” mainstream religious groups are probably pretty conservative, clinging to age old tradition. Change is bad. Along with the gun lobby and their membership plus others you can pretty much count on their vote. The liberals have their base also. Change is good. That’s why the battleground in recent elections is for the independents, the middle ground. 
       
          I don’t think there’s been a separation of church and state since the time of Christ.  As others mentioned, I agree it was just bad legislation by two branches of a dysfunctional Federal government. When there’s no state spats or invading forces and the Fed ventures out from their constitutional authority they get into trouble. They used to be just a group of wise men.

            


 

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans


@BigTom wrote:

If any church receives federal money they should give up their tax-exempt status.


+1. Not only that.

They should pay their employees from their revenue. Look at Chicago. The prime land there is owned by them. I understand that the Church sold a parking lot for 110 million dollars and the building "One Chicago" is being built. Now, all school buses serving their schools park on the street besides the regular city buses in the State Street block one lane. I had tough time taking my grand children to the regular schools.

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Contributor ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

Remember "Shoes of the Fisherman" with Anthony Quinn? A humble man becomes Pope and sells off all the treasures to feed the starving billion of Chinese to stop an impending World War. Not a bad idea. We'd keep the Gonzaga basketball team and Notre Dame football of course to continue punishing Brantley (GU) and the Baptists (ND). But us left footers don't need or deserve government money. Bad idea, je crois.

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Participant ○○○

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

Perhaps the Roman Catholic Church getting money doesn't bother me due to where I live.  In VA, church lands are not taxed.  Its not just the chapels, its the parking lots, its their retirement homes.  Then there is the exclusion from sales tax on everything from candles to leaf blowers.  No sales tax is collected in church bookstores; some sell computers, its a good way to save a few bucks.  

https://law.lis.virginia.gov/admincode/title23/agency10/chapter210/section310/

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Frequent Contributor

Re: Catholic Church and PPP Loans

I am forced to imagine a scenario wherein some previous administration gives billions to the Church of Islam. Even if said Church is pro-life, I have a hard time believing that it would not unleash a firestorm of epic proportions. Maybe we will find out next year? 

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