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Participant ○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

Thanks for the link.  I exited OAKEX in favor of EFAV last week. OAKIX for me approaching loss of nearly 50% of initial value in my PF.  These fulfill a diversifying role for Foreign Mkt exposure for me but too high-conviction value and not 'traditional' enough for my needs... I'll have no problem with the use of losses toward cap gains reduction.  Did you choose an alternative fund replacement for OAKIX?  I'm debating where to go with it if I liquidate or reduce position but am inclined to do that...

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Participant ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD


@mikes425 wrote:

Thanks for the link.  I exited OAKEX in favor of EFAV last week. OAKIX for me approaching loss of nearly 50% of initial value in my PF.  These fulfill a diversifying role for Foreign Mkt exposure for me but too high-conviction value and not 'traditional' enough for my needs... I'll have no problem with the use of losses toward cap gains reduction.  Did you choose an alternative fund replacement for OAKIX?  I'm debating where to go with it if I liquidate or reduce position but am inclined to do that...


In my taxable account, so far I’ve only added to my EM fund – HLEMX - Harding Loevner Emerging Markets Advisor

I’m also adding in my 401K equities to counterbalance any sales in taxable account. The only other international developed market fund I have in taxable account is DODFX, which is way too similar to OAKIX.

I’m considering just going to an index fund like - IXUS - iShares Core MSCI Total Intl Stk ETF

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Explorer ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

"Harding Loevner International Equity (HLMNX) and Oakmark International (OAKIX). These two funds, which were slowed by stylistic headwinds as well as by weak holdings, remain good options for investors who have long time horizons and understand the risks of their processes." - From M*

I like the way they put it

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Participant ○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

Yeah but....  I'm just checking the 1, 3, 5 even 10 year on OAKIX.  For all of the alleged artful value-intensive management, it doesn't look like it's done anything but track or lag the sector.  Or am I missing something????  I got rid of OAKEX but I suspect a similar picture.  I guess the question is, how much rope do you give it before you say, ok, this isn't worth the riskier style for International exposure.  Right now, in general seems just as well to have a lower exposure to that sector ..but that's, 'right now...'  

That being said, what's a good alternative to OAKIX ?  I'm inclined to bail with my loss sorta rapidly approaching 50% in it.

 

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Follower ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

@mikes425 

I own OAKIX DODFX and recently started rotating into FMIJX so that I do not have all deep value in my IRA. Take a look at

FMIJX it gets decent ratings and is more blended than the other 2. I have been getting killed in value stocks this quarter and need to figure out how to avoid this happening again . This coronavirus is the death of my portfolio in the financials space

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Follower ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

If you guys do not like this fund- stay the heck away from the following disaster experiments:

 

WEITZ PARTNERS VALUE

LONGLEAF PARTNERS FUND

ARIEL FUND

All 3 have very stubborn management teams without trading backgrounds who double down on losers until their losses reach 70% in down markets

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Participant ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD


@mikes425 wrote:

Yeah but....  I'm just checking the 1, 3, 5 even 10 year on OAKIX.  For all of the alleged artful value-intensive management, it doesn't look like it's done anything but track or lag the sector.  Or am I missing something????  I got rid of OAKEX but I suspect a similar picture.  I guess the question is, how much rope do you give it before you say, ok, this isn't worth the riskier style for International exposure.  Right now, in general seems just as well to have a lower exposure to that sector ..but that's, 'right now...' 

 


Was it 2010 that M* gave David Herro international fund manager of the decade (memory's foggy)? He had a good run, but in more recent years it looks like he's just not getting it. M* has a nice little write up on him -

David Herro is the Chief Investment Officer – International Equities at Harris Associates L.P. and serves as a Deputy Chairman and a Portfolio Manager of a number of Oakmark funds. Mr. Herro has been managing international portfolios since 1986, previously managing international portfolios for The State of Wisconsin Investment Board and The Principal Financial Group. Mr. Herro, who joined Harris Associates in 1992, holds a BS in business and economics from the University of Wisconsin – Platteville (1983) and an MA in economics from the University of Wisconsin – Milwaukee (1985).

B.S. University of Wisconsin-Platteville, 1983

M.A. University of Wisconsin–Milwaukee, 1985

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Participant ○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

well, rather glowing tribute to him and the funds just today from M* i believe... and appearances on financial media twice in the last week..   makes ya wonder!....

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Follower ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

keep in mind

 

1)us returns exceed intl

2) decent long term history still

3)outflows are hurting deep value strategy probably 

4) this crash is favoring momentum index funds

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Participant ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

I pulled the trigger and sold both my OAKIX and DODFX today.

Replacement - I’ve got a limit order pending to buy IXUS - iShares Core MSCI Total Intl Stk ETF.

Any thoughts on IXUS are appreciated. This is in a taxable account, and I prefer qualified dividends for tax purposes.

And thank you to all for your responses.

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Participant ○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

Nice rebound in both OAKIX and OAKEX yesterday. (edit to add:  AND TODAY too.)  Of course I dropped both earlier this month after years of underperformance; 38% loss in one of them for me.  Replaced with EFAV and another index ETF.... Wonder if this is the year they remarkably recover and skyrocket...  would be just my luck... Just didn't have the patience to ride them down after such poor 3 & 5 year return.   Herro has a high conviction value style that may benefit coming out of this market decline... Will be curious to see but i probably shouldn't watch them.

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Follower ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

PN- I normally like to painfully hold thru the end of year one of recovery and think you'll regret it, but I understand needing to say good riddance. I hope the rotation works for you. I have been finding myself needing to rotate more than 2010 recently- mid caps, small caps, long short it is hard to find a good active fund in those spaces as well.

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Follower ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

Not to get off topic, but can anyone suggest some funds you need to be willing to hold 12 years to get benefit from...you know, the really contrarian investors: here are some I know

FPA Crescent

Ariel Fund

Oakmark International 

Hussman Strategic Growth (although I wouldn't own it, manager is myopic)

Fairholme Fund (wouldnt own it either)

If you buy into some of these funds you have to be willing to go against the grain which can be hard to swallow for long. I normally will give a manager some time. Oakmark shined for one quarter last year, rising nearly 25% or something . Returns in waves is a good way to think of these funds 

 

 

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Participant ○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

@jmoney149   I'll probably wind up having some remorse on OAKIX sale per the point you make - yeah it's one that obviously takes long patience... 10+ year patience.  I suppose i could at least justify my sale as a tax loss harvesting move(?)  I'm 60'ish so maybe i'm not as patient as you might wanna be.  Not that i consider myself old at all, but for a 40/60 PF, OAK may just not be the best core international fund choice for basic diversification exposure to foreign markets.  It's obviously not as conventional an Int'l fund as others with Herro's strict value approach.  And sorry if i'm going off-off-topic with this; )

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Participant ○○○

Re: OAKIX down XX % YTD

My personal situation is that I did some tax loss harvesting in 2009 at the bottom of the crash back then. My OAKIX purchases date back to then and they had a very low tax basis. So that made this a difficult decision.

If any of you are in a similar situation in your taxable account, this is a good time to make a move. Good luck to all of you!

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